If I were a track owner/promoter

FLORIDA STOCK CAR RACING KARNAC's FLORIDA STOCK CAR RACING
1

Having raced now at a multitude of tracks I have been able to see both the good and bad aspects of track owners and promoters. Having seen what can work and what does not, i wish to share with you what a track would be like if i had the moey to own one or be a promoter for one.

  1. Limit the number of different classes that are run. Come up with a rules package to incorporate the hobby stock, pure stock, street stock cars all into one class. Take the mini stock back to what they are supposed to be… entry level. Sportsman, limited late models, late models, super late models: combine them and come up with a rules package to make them even. Modifieds- no motor rules.

  2. Work with the tire manufacturers to find a tire that lasts long. This will be a hard tire which will save the car owners money, even out the cubic dollars in your higher classes and provide for better racing.

  3. Get rid of radios and mirrors in the car. I can hear you now saying that is dangerous. Its not. It will keep people from making boneheaded banzai moves and leaders will not be blocking.

  4. instead of the radios, each car must have a raceceiver. One-way communication device from the pit tower to all drivers. It will speed up the line up and every driver will know at the same time that a caution is out. We use them up here in Ohio and i really like them.

  5. Since my track will only be running 4 classes, everyone will be running heat races. All classes qualify. top half run in the first heat, bottom half in second heat. Both heats are inverted so the fastest are at back. Gives the middle packers and back of the pack drivers the chance to at least win a race.

  6. Sorry, but no trophies. Money spent on them will go back into the purse.

  7. Each class has only one special race in a year. Every week you will run either 25 or 30 laps. Your one special race is 75-100 laps.

  8. Have not decided on payout, but if you are a true racer, you race for the glory of the win, the payout is just a bonus. But payout would be on par with what tracks currently have.

With these simple suggestions, I believe that racing would be better and more fans would come out. These are just my suggestions, feel free to add on or adjust as needed.

2

Good thinking. I agree with most of that except for the qualifying. That, in my opinion, is a waste of time, money, and fuel, not to mention boring. Use either points or passing points, my personal favorite. Just my $.25 worth (inflation, ya know). billy

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Missed one important thing! You would own stock in an aspirin factory!!
All great ideas, Remember I am the nut case that ALMOST bought a track but woke up and did not.
Qualifying using time trials is good once a month IF you pay the top three times. All the other nights all you need to do is HANDICAP the heats by EITHER Money won OR Points.
High points (money) starts on the tail of heat one with the other ODD numbers. Then 2nd in points (money) starts on the tail of heat two withe the other EVEN numbers. Makes for a good show for the fans.:ernaehrung004:

4

Desoto

John has proposed some rules for 2009 to combine the ASA/LM/LLM classes to run together. Any thoughts on his idea?? This would be at Desoto.
-----JIM----

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Point one:

Common set of rules with other tracks in the state.

Andr?

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Rules ???

One of the rules that screwed a lot of us was that if you did not run a crate motor then you had like three engine builders the series would approve. Those of us who build our own motors to the published rules were “out”.
Compression test and tiny cameras to check for flat top pistons and valve size can detect cheaters. With no cam lift rules then that factor is out. Head cc rules are easy enough to check, if suspect… pull one or both heads. Carbs are a no brainer. Don’t see a problem to combine a few classes for a big car count for the little guy, like me, and the big guys. Fan count would be better too. JMO :ernaehrung004:
----JIM----

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[QUOTE=calres22;16601]Having raced now at a multitude of tracks I have been able to see both the good and bad aspects of track owners and promoters. Having seen what can work and what does not, i wish to share with you what a track would be like if i had the moey to own one or be a promoter for one.

  1. Limit the number of different classes that are run. Come up with a rules package to incorporate the hobby stock, pure stock, street stock cars all into one class. Take the mini stock back to what they are supposed to be… entry level. Sportsman, limited late models, late models, super late models: combine them and come up with a rules package to make them even. Modifieds- no motor rules.

  2. Work with the tire manufacturers to find a tire that lasts long. This will be a hard tire which will save the car owners money, even out the cubic dollars in your higher classes and provide for better racing.

  3. Get rid of radios and mirrors in the car. I can hear you now saying that is dangerous. Its not. It will keep people from making boneheaded banzai moves and leaders will not be blocking.

  4. Sorry, but no trophies. Money spent on them will go back into the purse.

  5. Each class has only one special race in a year. Every week you will run either 25 or 30 laps. Your one special race is 75-100 laps.

  6. Have not decided on payout, but if you are a true racer, you race for the glory of the win, the payout is just a bonus. But payout would be on par with what tracks currently have.

With these simple suggestions, I believe that racing would be better and more fans would come out. These are just my suggestions, feel free to add on or adjust as needed.[/QUOTE]

One of the things that is a draw for many of the racers is the ability to move up from class to class… We all in the past have done that and some of us have moved back and/or regressed not always due to a fault of our own… The reason I make that statement is if you “squash” the Sportsman, llm, lm, slm together you are then taking out the move up factor that is present…
Now please don’t misunderstand me with this statement, I am not stating the move up difference between the LLM, LM, and the SLM’s…

I am stating that for the benefit of the Sportsman class… If my memory serves me right… The reason for this class originally was to provide a stepping stone, for both experience and money, to the upper classes if one so wishes… I know alot of people who can afford to work a sportsman up, but can’t swing the high dollars for the LLM, LM, or the SLM… And we all know, racers & promoters alike there is a huge difference in money and experience and several other factors… As you can see I am a proponent of the Sportsman class, due to the fact that the progression from Strictly to Mini to Super Stock to Sportsman, etc. etc. is an awesome learning experience for those who do it that way…

Each class offers more and different experiences in driving style/skills, building, wrenching, etc. to where when someone gets up to the LM area of skills they understand and know things that can help and be more beneficial to themselves and their team… Now understand that their are some who have been afforded a golden pocket and can just jump into an “upper class”, but for the most part, we all need to be honest with each other… The experience that one gains by moving up the ranks from class to class is invaluable… Hmmm maybe we can get a couple of our classes to go more than a lap or three without crashing by having more drivers with seat time…

About the trophy thing, I hate to say it, but the couple of dollars that a track spends on a trophy won’t make a difference in the kitty for the prize money… One must realize that the average “trophy” only costs a couple of dollars and is not a significant cost per class… And I hate to say it, but all of us drivers have that ego trip and that trophy is a heck of an ego boost when you look at it, especially after you have had a bad week or two or three or more right Boneman… In fact it can inspire a driver more after the fact than one thinks… The mind is a powerful thing… Hey and what are you going to do with the Strictly stock class which only gets trophies and a burger… I bet you would double or more the car count if you paid a little bit out to that class say…

            1st= $40.00     2nd= $30.00     3rd=  $20.00.....

Notice that 1st place is only double the entry/pit pass cost for most tracks… Now it doesn’t seem like alot, but it sure would inspire more folks to come out and play… BUT!!! make sure that the TECH is fair and level for that class just like any other class… I can remember years ago when I started and the entry class paid about that much and it was a “coooooool” thing to get that little shot of Green to help out costs…

Just thought I would throw a couple of points out to ponder… maybe if I feel ambitious I might ponder some more… Later…

Have a great day all…

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Dang a novel… Sorry all, don’t forget to bring the popcorn to read that bugger…

ROFLMAO

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Oglethorpe Speedway has a class called the “Enduro 440’s”. Basically, it’s a very low-buck, entry level class. The “440” part is the actual purse… each of the top 4 cars gets $110.00. All others are running for free, but it’s still an incentive to try to get up front, although dumping someone for 3rd place pays no better than settling for 4th in the first place!

Oh yeah… it’s run on a dirt track that has been flooded by the water truck, and they race in the DARK! Headlights, tail lights and horns are all working. The horn is how you get scored… if you don’t toot coming across the line, you aren’t scored for that lap! It’s a funny sight to see a car go into turn one, and then you see headlights, tail lights, headlights, tail lights, as the car is doing 360’s a few times.

It’s the only track I’ve been to that the crowd is willing to wait for 30-45 minutes AFTER the rest of the program to watch a 'junker" class run. I don’t think ANYONE left without watching the 440’s!

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Hi Jerry, do they have to use their turn signal?:ernaehrung004:

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combine them and come up with a rules package to make them even. Modifieds- no motor rules.

there really aren’t any good reasons for track specific rules … except for all of the cars that would have to grandfathered in.

most of the major classes have one or more major sanctioning bodies which already have a good rule set. like, fer instance, IMCA asphalt mods are down at NSS every spring. wouldn’t that just be special if FASCAR modified drivers could run with the guys from up north?

Frank Kimmel Street Stock Nationals with maybe a 362 cube limit or something.

etc, etc

2. Work with the tire manufacturers to find a tire that lasts long.

you don’t have to “work” with a tire manufacturer. go on their web site and look at their catalog. they’re happy to tell you exactly what they’ve got and exactly how hard it is.

the choice to pick a soft tire is purely that of the track owner / tire vendor.


3. Get rid of radios and mirrors in the car.

i’m fine with throwing the radios away, not so much with the mirrors.

It will keep people from making boneheaded banzai moves

how long have you been around racers? there isn’t any way to ‘prevent’ boneheaded banzai moves, that’s up to the guy holding the wheel. check out Stenhouse taking out Speed in the Sunday ARCA race. ARCA didn’t do anything about that but they sat Speed down after he went back out and wrecked the hell out of Stenhouse in retaliation. that’s an officiating error. if Stenhouse knew he’d get a one lap penalty for wrecking the race and series point leader out, maybe he wouldn’t have been so eager to do it.

and leaders will not be blocking.

pretty much the same thing as above, except if you take their mirror away they’ll be “blocking” by default because they won’t know that somebody is right on their butt and they shouldn’t be running from apex-to-wall-wall-to-apex.

4. instead of the radios, each car must have a raceceiver. One-way communication device from the pit tower to all drivers.

not necessarily against it, it’s just one more expense we don’t really need.

5. Since my track will only be running 4 classes, everyone will be running heat races.

fine, fine.

All classes qualify.

say what? what’s the point of heat races if you’re qualifying anyways?

seriously, there’s no need to reinvent the wheel. lineups are set by inverted season points. newcomers/irregulars start behind track regulars. back to the future baby.


Both heats are inverted so the fastest are at back.

what penalty will you institute for sandbagging the heat race? how will you determine that sandbagging has taken place?

better to set feature lineup by inverted points and/or offer purse bonuses to the car which gains the most positions in the feature.


6. Sorry, but no trophies. Money spent on them will go back into the purse.

trophy and a checker flag picture have a disproportionate impact driver desire. especially with the purses so low.

7. Each class has only one special race in a year.

perhaps a little excessive but “special” races are overdone.

12

[QUOTE=Todd McCreary;16676][I]
and leaders will not be blocking.

pretty much the same thing as above, except if you take their mirror away they’ll be “blocking” by default because they won’t know that somebody is right on their butt and they shouldn’t be running from apex-to-wall-wall-to-apex.

[/QUOTE]

Once again Todd The Tool spouts off crap of which he has no real racing knowledge. Just because someone is behind you doesn’t mean you have to pull over and let them go by. Every track in every division I have ever run, once someone is at your door with their bumper (Front tire in front of rear tire for you less knowledgeable) the position, and the line in which you chose to run is yours. Especially in non radio racing.

Todd proved he was a douche bag to me when I was down there by his bitter complaining that I didnt “give him room” because I did not roll over and play dead when he was behind me.

Ever heard the phrase “catching someone is one thing passing is another”?

That means you may be fast enough to catch someone but if you are not fast enough to pass (i.e get to their door before entering the corner), then it is not your night to win. Just because a faster car is behind you does not give them the right to think you should move over and let them go. Oh yeah, and if you had hit me like you said you were going to, you would have had to fix that car again for rex, cause homey dont play that. I do have a violent temper when I feel someone is trying to rough me up. I have no problem destroying my own car to teach someone a lesson. Especially a geek with less racing experience than some 12 years olds.

If you are going to play a mans game, then expect to be able to back up the mouth you carry around with you Todd. I doubt you can because you look like the kid that everyone gave swirlies in school.

13

If I were a track owner/promoter, I would sell to the highest bidder. Don’t know how these guys financially do it every week, providing a playground for 35 drivers and 150 spectators.

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oh $h!- hes back

hey ovalracer44 its a good thing you live 6 hours away.

ps. your a sure winner for the bigest whiner an big mouth award

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What’s a swirlie?

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Why is it a good thing I live 6 hours away? You dont have the brass to say anything to me in person. You dont even have the brass to reveal who you are on here.

I guess if telling it like it is and not how it might be is whining, then hand over the trophy. I do not care what anyone thinks about me. I do not need validation from an anonymous name on an internet forum. I highly doubt that half the people on this forum with “all the answers” have been half as successful on and off the track as I have, and Im half the age of most.

And at the wishes of the people I will no longer spend a dime on Florida Racing. Charities included. Sorry Rick B.

17

Where the strong Alpha Male types pick up a dork, stick their head in the toilet and flush it, giving said dork a new hair-doo.

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Kevo, whats happening man? It sounds like you have had a few yourself. Its great to see your done pouting. JK glad to see your back.

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The only name I answer to is Kevin.

Im not back in the traditional sense. I am here merely to be a thorn in Todd’s side.

20

10-13-2008, 09:31 PM

hmmmm. i’m seem to remember Kevo saying something or other … ( scratches head )

http://www.realracinusa.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16017&postcount=34
10-03-2008, 12:08 AM
Moderators please remove my account from this site.
I hate hypocrites.

wow. only ten days to show us exactly how much you hate yourself. good job Kevo.

course, i did kind of call out that this was going to happen when i pointed out that if you had the balls to back up your words you wouldn’t come back and the account being open or closed would be irrelevant.

Once again Todd The Tool spouts off crap of which he has no real racing knowledge.

yep, i’ve only been around racers, cars and tracks for 35 years now. course, i am a little short on “on track” experience. tell you what, you take this up with Ron ( who has been racing for 35 years ) and tell me if you get a different answer.

Todd proved he was a douche bag to me when I was down there by his bitter complaining that I didnt “give him room” because I did not roll over and play dead when he was behind me.

i guess reading comprehension and logic really is this bad nowadays. i made ONE, count them, ONE remark about having exhausted all passing attempts without contact ( vs your almost all night long commentary on your gay porn internet business ) and that i was going to have to progress to a bump and run. which, every time i’ve ever heard it talked about, is perfectly legitimate. a little aggressive, but legitimate. “rubbin is racin” and all that, you know.

where, if you had just given the outside on the straight i would have never made contact with you and would never have gotten around you with my car pushing like it was. and i’d have been satisfied with finishing behind you because you gave me a lane and i couldn’t do any more with it than that. and we’d have put on a show for the fans … crazy, i know.

If you are going to play a mans game, then expect to be able to back up the mouth you carry around with you Todd. I doubt you can because you look like the kid that everyone gave swirlies in school.

what? i’m supposed to break down blubbering now? maybe i should make comments about how geeky and weak you look?

i don’t threaten people Kevo.

but i will tell you this: i firmly believe in a right to self defense.

you come on down here and take a swing ( from the front like a real man, please ). we’ll see what happens.

i’ll bet you wouldn’t be half this obnoxious if you had managed to finish in front of me. that must really be eating at you, huh?


I highly doubt that half the people on this forum with “all the answers” have been half as successful on and off the track as I have, and Im half the age of most.

we aren’t as “successful” as him so we aren’t permitted to speak an opinion that wasn’t previously vetted by the almighty Kevo. it’s in his copy of the Constitution, you know? :dry:

yeah, that last, uh, “accomplishment” you’ve got on the back of your trailer. the 2007 OSW Winter Series Mini-Stock champ? i’d, uh, be a lot more impressed if i didn’t know that consisted of showing up all four weeks when nobody else did. i hope one or two of the rest of your “championships” are a little more substantive than that.

i’m not sure anybody else took Rusty that seriously about using the Winter Series to “pad their resumes” that they actually painted it on something. i guess everybody else just has too much self respect.

Where the strong Alpha Male types pick up a dork, stick their head in the toilet and flush it

or that, you could try that on me. this could get amusing. we’ll damn sure sort out the alpha’s from the gamma’s in a hurry.

And at the wishes of the people I will no longer spend a dime on Florida Racing.

http://www.realracinusa.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16017&postcount=34
oh darn the luck. he gets all mouthy after he promises “…I will gladly stay the fuck out of florida.”

isn’t that convenient? yeah, i thought so too.

yo, Kevo, if you really have the cajones you think you’ve got you could have told me all that stuff to my face. instead of, you know, running away to South Carolina and doing it over the internet.