Yes, friends and neighbors, another one of my patented “what if?” threads.
The premise(s):
>I love the modifieds. Mo cars is mo-betta.
>Currently the modified engine costs at New Smyrna are…serious.
>I know of at least one car that no longer competes due at least in part to not enough motor–or enough cash to logically spend to get a competitive motor.
>Emods were not the answer.
So, what about a 602 crate with the following modifications allowed:
>Unlimited roller cam and valve springs
>Unlimited non dominator style 4 barrel carb and intake
>Unlimited exhaust.
>Unlimited chip in ignition
That’s it. Other than that–stock, stock, stock. In other words, all the go you can get through 1.94 & 1.5" stock valves.
Theoretically relatively inexpensive and easy to tech. More power than an emod, less than current, and a way to have larger fields.
And yes, they would be different from “west coast” rules, but then, so are front chassis specs and tires, and simply not that many modifieds seem to pull in either direction.
OldSchool, I think an e mod class with Sportsman motor rules would be a much better choice. Still allow the MSD boxes and distributor. The new Holley 4412 carburetor without choke towers would be nice. It passes all the gauges of the current 4412 with choke towers too. Those are my thoughts for an affordable Modified division.
-JIM-
[QUOTE=OldSchool+;169873]Yes, it is called “the heads”.
Any ideas that are, you know…constructive?[/QUOTE]
So constructively speaking, you believe it’s a good what if idea to suggest increasing the power on a 602 which will scatter the bottom end at high RPM’s.
[QUOTE=OldSchool+;169873]Yes, it is called “the heads”.
Any ideas that are, you know…constructive?[/QUOTE]
The 604 is a good option for power, reliability, and cost containment. It can be competitive at smaller tracks against the big engines as well. It’s also approved for use at most if not all tracks in the south.
The E mod class with the 602 crate engine was a great class . where they screwed up was it should’ve been crate engine only . the 112 car ran around out there with a built motor winning every week because his motor was illegal any fool could see that . so for you guys who get on here and say it wasn’t a great class you’re wrong and you guys keep getting on here downing the class you didn’t even run the class even funnier so what would you know? Anytime the track could put a class together and save the racers money is a win-win that’s a no-brainer .
[QUOTE=UREZ2PASS;169875]The 604 is a good option for power, reliability, and cost containment. It can be competitive at smaller tracks against the big engines as well. It’s also approved for use at most if not all tracks in the south.
Didn’t those Emods run a 2-barrel ?[/QUOTE]
Yes the e mods ran a 2 barrel 4412, even the crate if I remember correctly. The new generation 4412(and I use one at the shorter tracks), is almost like a 650 4 barrel. Quick response without waiting for the back 2 to kick in. As far as the open mods being faster, there was only about 1 second or so between the lap times difference.
The e mods had a better car count than the open mods at NSS, and more were being put together for the 2015 season till they were cut.
-JIM-
You’re absolutely correct Jim . the real reason why the e- mods were cut was because of two crybabies in the big mod class I won’t mention names but go back and see last year what two car showed up every race that didn’t normally show up every race . I know for a fact four guys who no longer race anymore because they cut this class . They thought if they cut this class everybody running E- mod would build a big motor how stupid . the whole reason they were racing because the crate engine was so cheap. And don’t forget guys the sportsman class class run the same engine so tell us again how it the crate engine isn’t working.
[QUOTE=ocalasp76;169880]Yes the e mods ran a 2 barrel 4412, even the crate if I remember correctly. The new generation 4412(and I use one at the shorter tracks), is almost like a 650 4 barrel. Quick response without waiting for the back 2 to kick in. As far as the open mods being faster, there was only about 1 second or so between the lap times difference.
The e mods had a better car count than the open mods at NSS, and more were being put together for the 2015 season till they were cut.
-JIM-[/QUOTE]
Thanks Jim, I’ve heard so many drivers say they don’t run NSS because they don’t have enough motor. I’ve always wanted to do track segment times to compare the top 5 mods in the corners. I’m sure many that are down on power are getting pulled down the straights but their corner exit speed may be slower.
I think it would be a good test to have a special mod race with restrictor plates. That would give the fast guys some recognition if they can still win with equal power and the guys down on power a different mindset as to racing NSS.
Respectfully, they were deemed to not be quick or interesting enough.
I would suggest that the idea was good, but the execution did not cut it. That is, they were less attractive than the full blown mods, and probably perceived as costing the top class car count (true or not).
Would further suggest that they will not be returning.
So, the question is, how to build on what they did, but get things faster for both the fans and the Symons & Tucker crowd, while the car owners can see a savings in the relatively near future in engine costs.
And by all means kill the moniker “Emod”?? That was a death blow before the first race. Sounds like modified golf carts.
And why run a 2bbl that is “almost” as good as a 4bbl? In fact, why limit the 4bbl to 650cfm, especially at NSS?
And restrictor plates? EZ is entitled to his opinion, but in my opinion they tend to suckle (however, apologies, I thought you were being sarcastic earlier…).
Again, am sort of on the same page, though. My thought is limit the heads, you limit the power (and rpm), which then limits the need for expensive bottom end parts. And that limits the investment required.
1.94 valve heads would come off those corners like gangbusters, and that is what makes for good racing.
I would suggest we don’t need open wheel Sportsman (though I dearly love the Sportsman), we need cheaper modifieds without losing much in the excitement dept.
Respectfully, they were deemed to not be quick or interesting enough.
I would suggest that the idea was good, but the execution did not cut it. That is, they were less attractive than the full blown mods, and probably perceived as costing the top class car count (true or not).
Would further suggest that they will not be returning.
So, the question is, how to build on what they did, but get things faster for both the fans and the Symons & Tucker crowd, while the car owners can see a savings in the relatively near future in engine costs.
And by all means, “Emod”?? That was a death blow before the first race. Sounds like modified golf carts.
And why run a 2bbl that is “almost” as good as a 4bbl? In fact, why limit the 4bbl to 650cfm, especially at NSS?
Call them “modifieds”.[/QUOTE]
I have to agree the emods were a snooze fest at NSS, but they put on a hell of a show at OSW the times I watched. They had 12 or so cars at the weekly races and I think 20+ at a couple of the bigger races.
Old-school what you’re saying doesn’t make sense about the E mod class if that’s the case you’re saying that the sportsman class is on its way out the door do you realize there was no difference between the E mod and the sportsman car except body same tires same crate engine same rear end same four-speed transmission etc except the E mod was lighter if they had put the four barrel on the E mod would’ve been faster than the sportsman. as far as restrictor plate racing the whole purposes was that not have to spend so much of building a high dollar engine I can guarantee you the 15 and the 66 and the 4B is not going to run restrictor plate because the 21 modified is slow . And I completely disagree with you on the E mod class
“Old-school what you’re saying doesn’t make sense…”–STC1
Yes, a long term problem for me!
Here is the deal:
Ultimately, as I have stated in previous threads, I think the same thing could happen with the Sportsman cars–punch up the power a little, keep the costs low, call them “Late Model Sportsman”.
BUT, New Smyrna has a decent field of Super Lates and Pro lates, so car count is not currently an issue there.
Further, the Sportsman class also has great car count and produces great racing as is.
On the other hand, I would suggest that there could be more mods, with closer competition.
My understanding is that the emods ran a similar engine package to the Sportsman cars–a package that works well for the Sportsman, but failed to impress in the mods.
Make sense now? Makes sense here in my padded cell…
"And I completely disagree with you on the E mod class" –STC1
You are entitled. But there is no emod class at NSS.
As I have stated the E mod class was canceled do to crybabies in th big mod class that’s why trust me . I have inside info on that . that’s fact I told other facts on here and was told I was full of it .ended up be true a couple guys ate crow . What happen to Melbourne motor sports park ? I told you so . think about this how many E mods are running big motor class now 76 as far as I know maybe one more . How many big mods show up 6 wow 2nd year since Emods are gone working real well .
