Well said Patrick . To bad somebody like the Rays didn’t take over osw can you imagine that track repaved everything fixed it was the best short track in FL. Had some good racing action .
[QUOTE=Patrick Thomas 25;171479]…What we all need to look at is this, Almost every racetrack has decided to stop officially posting on Karnac. Why because they can’t control what’s being said. Nobody tells Yoho, or Ronnie, or Rex, or the Rays, or the Harts how to run their racetracks, and them not be able to control it. It’s their home, they will run it the way they see fit. It’s us as racers and race fans choice to go where we want. If you want to go to a track go, but why bash these people and racetracks that give us a place to go play. Look at all the closed down tracks, speed world would be awesome to race at this Friday night, but that place has been bashed so many times, why would ozzy open the gates and pay us to come their. The perception on here says we don’t like the way they are doing it, so why try.
Patrick Thomas 111[/QUOTE]
Sorry if this is a hijack but I have to understand something here.
Patrick I respect you as a driver and as someone who knows the sport here in Florida so I want to understand what you are saying;
Track owners in Florida do not post on Karnac because it hurts their feelings when folks don’t agree with them??? Is that right?
I mean this in all seriousness- Are they really that thin skinned that they cannot take a little disagreement?
If this is true it explains ALOT about why things are the way they are in the Florida pavement scene.
In the interest of transparency I will admit I am banned from the Bronson facebook page for comments I made about a rain out call last season.
So I knew one track owner was pretty thin skinned but I always wondered why the others didn’t post on Karnac- wow, just wow… 
I believe the reason racetracks have stopped posting on Karnac, is because there are people that will just post whatever they can to make a certain track look bad. And here on Karnac, you can do it under any alias you would like to use, with nobody knowing who you are or being able to figure out who those people under alias’ might be. So why post here and have the same people with personal vendettas against a racetrack, or a driver, or an official, get basically picked on with no repercussions because they use alias, and never say who they are. Facebook is the new medium all speedways are using from the north to the south. Speed51 is also another way, since they have no open message board. The tracks website would be next.
If you notice Showtime posts very little here, the Rays at Citrus have posted nothing, Desoto since Linda has gone has posted nothing, Auburndale only posts schedule of events for the race weekend for the most part, Bronson posts nothing here, and now Newsmyrna has chosen to do the same.
It just makes their lives easier I’m sure.
Patrick Thomas 111
“[The Florida Promoters feel that no one should tell them] how to run their racetracks…It’s their home, they will run it the way they see fit.”–PT25
So, let’s assume that Patrick’s premise is correct.
Fair enough, the Promoters have a business to run, clearly they do not need to get involved personally at the discussion level unless they want to.
So, what’s next? Logically…
Comment on what is good and works well, and make positive suggestions that are aimed at gaining larger crowds and making more money.
If the Promoters read something that sounds promising, they can weigh the idea and decide to implement it if they choose, and KARNAC input then moves the Sport forward. Of course, it is their prerogative to not take suggestions, even well intentioned ones.
Seems simple enough.
Further, while I find the “troll/rant” posts to be occasionally amusing, they are being ignored by the tracks–as they should be.
Annnnnnnnnnd presumably that behavior is attention motivated, and if there is no attention…
Scott, I’ll say something. When Donnie was in charge of OSW, he would read Karnac, but not participate. He felt it was a waste of his time and would get nowhere. Ozzy is the same way. He has told me himself he has viewed this site, I think he even said he is a member, but he refuses to participate. It’s just not worth the time because you are damned if you do, and damned if you don’t.
I may not be as active as I once was, but I visit this site daily to read and sometimes I just sit back, shake my head and laugh at the ridiculousness. To go along with Patrick, there are definitely people who have vendettas against certain tracks, drivers or just people in general. They come here and hide behind a fake name and no one except maybe Rick, knows who a lot of them really are.
Honestly, I feel bad for Rick because he has spent a lot of time and money trying to build Karnac into something great. Unfortunately, it turns into nothing more than a giant pissing match 9 times out of 10. The tracks in FL are actually smart for avoiding that, and not promoting that, because they know the negative image can hurt them, just as the negativity on any and all social media can hurt them.
Sadly, I don’t think it will ever really change.
Things to be Thankful For
You know, we really are Blessed!
We have five tracks in the area, and two of them have risen from ashes.
Think about it. In the rest of our lives in the secular world we have:
>Identity Confusion
>Bathroom Confusion
>Kids (and many adults) that do not believe they can live on their own, much less fabricate a race car.
>Dilution, if not replacement, of our culture
>Unsafe streets
>And larger threats as well.
>fwd street cars that are mostly an embarrassment.
Overall, it ain’t good…
But at the track, there are real men working on real race cars, even the girls in the pits are “real”. It is like a time warp back to the '60s.
And then there is the racing! Man, at the track when it is close or there is an on track “disagreement”, when else do you feel that alive? My 90 year old Father, who doesn’t get around much these days, was cheering Robbie Cooper on with the rest of the crowd this past weekend…
I have said it before & will say it again: Track owners and operators–Thank you for all that you do.
And the Sportsman cars?
They are currently enjoying some of the best car counts and best racing in the state.
Guys have been building, buying, or finding a sponsor to buy race engines forever. If vortec heads are cheaper than camel humps, that is a net plus.
It ain’t broke, so we should celebrate, imo.
And congrats again to the #111 team, all rhetoric aside, their combination and driver won New Smyrna’s most recent feature.
This turned into a pretty good discussion.
I would guess Ricky Brooks reads this zoo occasionally and I’d like to know if there are any plans to bring the, mainly motor, rules in the Panhandle closer to the rest of Fla as the class is really struggling.
Phil as far as osw people getting on here and expressing their opinions had nothing to do with osw not opening .Ozzie made a lot of broken promises from the first day of his meeting he had . Where you there ? And I also heard they were in shock when they found out that in circle track racing they have to pay more than just the top three cars . If I remember right the only thing Ozzie did was raise the prices at the back gate From 20.00 to 30.00 and that’s all he did couldn’t even fix the light bulb and turn two or mow the grass in the pit stands so a lot of effort wasn’t put into anything when he took over oh wait a minute yeah he did paint the stands but I think that was done for his drifting crap .
One thing you guys gotta remember about Ozzy, he runs a successful business with his drag strips, so he isn’t a dummy. With OSW, he got screwed to start, so he passed it on to the racers instead of doing it the right way. The drag racing side of the screwing is well documented on Yellow Bullet. I will not defend him, I know he made a ton of promises that never came to fruition. I could frankly care less about OSW at this point. It’s a dead horse. My reason for even bringing them into the discussion was simply to verify pretty much what Scott said to begin with, as well as make the point that no matter what you do (and this goes for every track in FL, CT or wherever, it’s a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation. Not everyone will always be happy so the best thing to do seems to be do it your way and if it works, awesome, if it doesn’t then you are SOL.
As a side note, Ozzy has a great thing going for himself with the Oval as much as we all hate it. It’s sad for those of us who want to see stock cars back there full time, something that very likely will never happen. The drifting gang doesn’t require purses, it brings it’s own staff and is for the most part, self sufficient. All he seems to do, is unlock the gate, and turn on the lights when needed. They do the rest. That’s an easy buck for him right there, and I am sure he makes a pretty good profit off of pretty much zero investment over on that side of the property. Even up here at Thompson Speedway, with our big crowds, nice car counts and tons of sponsors, they are just barely keeping ahead.
Short track racing is not a lucrative business for anyone anymore. Do I blame Ozzy at this point? Hell no… Do I wish it was different? Hell yes! OSW deserves to live, but it likely never will again.
Osw
Wow, I thought this thread would be a quick congratulations to the deserving NSS winners, Brad May & Patrick Thomas!
At any rate, regarding Speed World, I created a recent thread with the intent of resurrecting OSW, written from the perspective of track ownership and profitability.
I am available for honest and objective profit-based suggestions, as are a wealth of racers that would like the track to succeed, through Karnac or otherwise.
From there, it is up to Speed World ownership to determine if it is desirable & viable and move forward, either with assistance or without.
[QUOTE=OldSchool+;171492]Wow, I thought this thread would be a quick congratulations to the deserving NSS winners, Brad May & Patrick Thomas!
At any rate, regarding Speed World, I created a recent thread with the intent of resurrecting OSW, written from the perspective of track ownership and profitability.
I am available for honest and objective profit-based suggestions, as are a wealth of racers that would like the track to succeed, through Karnac or otherwise.
From there, it is up to Speed World ownership to determine if it is desirable & viable and move forward, either with assistance or without.[/QUOTE]
You are wasting your time, and energy even caring at this point OS. Even when Carl was there, the place was in a downward spiral. Ozzy just put the nail in the coffin.
I see. Their prerogative.
But for the record, you and I as well as “Katlizy” and many others here on KARNAC did our best to assist.
Maybe the drifters will sub-let the joint and then in addition to their own events, host stock car events.
Think of it: Schlitz-aritas & refried beans-on-nachos available at the concession stand, and a Nissan 240SX pace car (sideways, of course)…
It’s their money and their ballgame
Fair enough. I doubt I would shell out a bucket full of money just to listen to somebody else’s suggestions on how to spend it. But a couple things that I don’t think track owners here in Florida seem to recognize. First off with all the businesses that fail nationwide that operate five,six,even seven days a week, how are you so confident you will succeed operating four or five days a month? There are other things that can be done with your properties on days that you don’t race.After all a racetrack is just as much an event center as it is anything else.It just happens to have a big oval smack dab in the middle of it.Secondly Florida is unique in the fact that it has a large transient population. Here today gone for six months tomorrow. What is the one constant? The school’s and the parents of the students. You absolutely need to get the schools involved down here because they are a very large part of the year round residents.There are a lot of ways to do this none of which involve a big monetary commitment. This could bring people to your racetrack who ordinarily never step foot on your property. Not to mention this may include a segment of the population that may come to bat for you in time of need. But why would you want their involvement when all they could do is maybe help keep your gates open?It sounds like a lot of effort and talking to people you may not want to talk to. News flash!! That’s what a business involves. It’s not all pie in the sky,go there for a few hours a week and go home.That’s called winning the power ball.
We could give out free race tickets along with the free lunches and backpacks.
Then they could all look at their guvment provided phones instead of coming to the track.
Actually, it pretty much looks like racing is done by the racers and for the racers. Like a fraternity, sort of.
That is, from track operators to car owners to race fans, you either “get it” or you don’t.
Reaching out to the uninterested masses is not viable, imo.
What did the new ownership at Citrus and Showtime have? A decent sized chunk of cash dedicated to racing, with the understanding that a return–or even keeping the original considerable investment-- was questionable.
That is what it took, and that is what it will take with OSW.
Unfortunately, I think Phil is keeping all the investors with Racing in their blood up north.
Yep.Because no business needs new customers. Then when all us old timers die off there will be plenty of empty seats for our ghosts to come sit in.
Zero4, For sure, those are not bad suggestions, and will help peripherally, but precisely that sort of thing has been tried at Speedworld, and…
I would suggest it is more for the few kids that you can save.
But the track? Money is what makes the racing world go around, and there isn’t any right now to spend on Speedworld.
But what I’m talking about isnt giveaways O.S.
Giveaways only work for the short term and may be great for one night but…they mainly take away from profit and purse structure. I’m talking about truly getting schools involved in ways that show you are embracing them and the community just as much as you want them to embrace you.Especially in the somewhat smaller communities. (And I don’t know for sure if you can count Orlando as such but Bithlo sure is.)If I go into specifics we could run this thread to twenty pages.But you can go to a race up in my old home state of Ohio and I’m talking about tracks like Fremont speedway,Attica Raceway ,Shady Bowl Speedway and the stands are packed and they are located in towns by and large that you can blink your eyes and miss them as you go through. And a lot of it is because they have very close ties to the community,both business and school. They promote the school’s and their high school football games,print their football schedule in the track program,display the local teams schedules etc.I mean real community involvement and events geared towards the schools at the speedway. I keep hearing a lot of tracks say that the youth is the future of the sport.Well then prove you mean that !!!
Zerofor,
I think those are admirable goals, truly.
And I think they may grow the sport incrementally.
But I would suggest they fall more under “philanthropy” than “profitability”.
If, IF, a track had the interest and had the walls painted, the taxes current, the racers happy, the second mortgage caught up, and was actually operating in the black, then it might (or might not, depending on the viewpoint of the operator) be something to think about.
But it is not going to make any real money in the short term–or bankroll a start up.
It takes a large available source of funds to be able to absorb those costs. And where do the funds come from? Why, same as the car owners.
In most cases from money hard earned elsewhere as a business owner. From previous hard work and investment and risk.
Then, because they are racers at heart, they roll the dice and invest in a race track.
Again, thanks go out to those brave souls.
Remember, Citrus general admission $5. Those are 1965 prices. And they are there to gain market share (in fans).
They also have a very real cost, in lost revenue to offset no doubt huge startup costs.
Again, there has to be significant fundage available upfront to make it work. I just do not see any other way.