Ronnie, you know a lot about cars and chassis. Was his chassis a super late model chassis or not? Has he driving been driving a super the last 2 years or a gokart?
FYI. The last time I saw the kid race a few months ago it was at CRA race it wasn’t the Stars series and he was running a super spec with a 390. It must the first time he hasn’t run with a 390 or a 750 with a restrictor or something It ain’t that big of a difference. It ain’t like it was his second race. Just sayin.
With so many different variations of ABC templet bodied racecars, how can anyone keep up with what different sanctioning bodies call them ? Coil-over chassis, big spring chassis, crate late, super late, limited late, super engine, spec engines, crate engines, or whatever else somebody somebody calls them. Dang confusing if you ask me.
Good topic for a new thread.
As far as I know, and for as long back as I recall a Super Late Model has EVERYTHING to do with motor. The chassis, a full tubular design, can run as
a Crate, a Pro LM, or a Super. The Limiteds have normally been restricted to Stock front clips.
Mr Dunn… If all you’ve had in your cars are Crate motors, then no, you have not run a “Super”’ LM. Youve run against them, but you didn’t have one.
I know you can run a fab clip coilover car in LLM in FASCAR with a weight penalty. I always thought the main difference between a LLM and a SLM was the engine.
Joe… The Dirt LM’s went through that same evolution a few hears back. Stock clips became hard to find, so they allowed the tubular front clip, but with a penalty so as not to obsolete the stock clip cars.
Same thing with the Asphalt LM’s. Parts availability caused a loosening of the original rules (besides that the LLM’s also run a 2-bbl carb).
Not sure what book Mr Dunn is looking at, but most everyone else seems to understand that the Engine Is what makes a Super, not the chassis.
Thanks for hijacking this thread guys… Can’t we have any fun?
[QUOTE=Frasson118;91182]
Not sure what book Mr Dunn is looking at, but most everyone else seems to understand that the Engine Is what makes a Super, not the chassis.[/QUOTE]
Jerry. If you put a super late model motor into a mini cup chassis do you got a super late model or a bad a$$ mini cup? It has everything to do with the chassis Jerry. The motor is just the HP rating. But good luck with that!!!
If it is a stock front clip it is a limited and it it is a tubed front clip it is a super. That is why there is a penalty for running a super clip with the llm’s. Go on Port City and Howe and find out for your self. When you call them to talk about chassis they ask, what are you looking for a llm or a super. They don’t care what type of motor you got.
So Jerry. Are you trying to say If I call Port City and tell them I want a new chassis and I tell them I have a crate that I will get a different chassis than if I am running a super? Are you saying that when we won The Super Late Model 150 with a crate we didn’t win a super late model race? Should I send the check and trophy back? When Russell win in the Fups with his super that has been de-tuned to run with the llm and crates was it not a super anymore? Or even better yet. Was Erik Jones running the same super late model chassis he has run the last year and a half or did he have to get a different chassis because he put a motor in it that has 80 more hp than his spec motor. Im 100% sure it is the same super chassis. I don’t care if he’s got the motor out of his moms pickup in it. It is still a super late model. The hp rating has nothing to do weather or not the chassis is a llm or a super.
Jerry. The average fan in the stands like yourself might think that the engine makes it a super and I can understand that cause you never owned one or know the difference. Car owners like myself know the difference. There is about 1000 super late models for sale on racing junk that don’t even have a motor in them. Does that mean they are not super late models??? Really??? You can believe what ever you want.
Sorry Dave. But we are still discussing Jones. Why don’t you put up some pictures of Chris Jones that I mentioned?
In my World
a Super Late Model has a race engine with no stock parts and few limitations.
I’ve never heard of a super being considered as a chassis style until I read this thread. In the mid 80’s my late model engines did not have even ONE part that was used in production automobiles. In my opinion Mr South does not have a super. If I had a super engine in a stock clip car what class would I be in?
At some tracks we also had various formulas back then to allow lower classes to run with us for the same purse.
ASA / AllPro (spec series) cars were restricted late model engines (compression & carb) and template bodies that were not competitive with late models. V6 engines were introduced with a weight break and were more than competitive at some tracks. Nobody with an ASA V6 car thought they had a Late Model for non sanctioned shows.
We had fully fabricated straight rail and perimeter chassis (late model) along with stock clip cars( limited legal) but your class was late model if your engine was.
I know the names and rules for all these classes have changed over the years but the basics have not.
The change brought about by ASA / AllPro in the early 80’s has contributed greatly to the decline of real late model racing in yet another of my opinions.
Larry Glendenning (another oldtimer with a “good old days” story)
Barnaby Jones
Sorry I was off topic.
Mr Dunn is making my point for me. If you call Howe, or whoever, there may be very minor differences in how things are built to accommodate whatever engine package you have, but it’s not entirely a different car. More or less, there are 2 choices… Late Model (full tubular chassis) or a Limited (Stock clip). If you take your tubular chassis, and stick a Crate in it, you have a Crate Late Model… If you stick a 700 HP McGunegill in it, you have a Super.
Mr Dunn, you own a Crate car… Not a Limited ( because of chassis design), and you don’t have a Super (because of engine).
Has there ever been an occasion that maybe you interpreted something wrong, or are the other people always idiots? You ain’t perfect chief.
Dave… Sorry about the hijack…
East Bay Sprint racer Danny Jones
I have no idea if it’s motor or chasy that makes slm’s. But what I would like to know is, is this kid really is 15. And he’s been racing this kind of car for two years? Why was he allowed in this size car at 13? That’s way to young in my opion!
I can take my car to any super late model race just the way it sits today and race it and I will be legal with on weight pentalitys or changes what so ever. So why aint it a super??? Tell me that Jerry? If it weren’t a legal super than why do they let me run???
I am pretty sure that you could put a super motor in a mini cup car and it would not be a super. Why? Because it ain’t a super chassis. The motor don’t make it a super.
If you take a LLM motor and put it in a super chassis, it ain’t legal in LLM with out a weight penalty??? Why??? because it is a super chassis not an LLM chassis.
If I have a super chassis and I put a super motor in it that is crap and only puts out 425hp is it still a super??? Sure it is. It don’t matter how much HP it has.
If I enter a super race with a super chassis and I have a crate in it and I win. Did I win a super race or a crate race.
Jerry. You are saying that I don’t have a super. If I put a 390 or a 750 on my car than I got a legal super. Nothing has changed on the car except the carb. If we won would it be a win in our first start in a super. Nothing has change on the car except a few extra hp just like Jones car. For me it is hard to say that somebody won in their second race when they have over 40 starts in the same car with just a few less hp. Nothing really changed except a little hp.
And Jerry. I can go out to my shop and wrench on my super all I want. I might not be perfect but I do have a super. What do you got? You got a LLM(stock front clip) or you got a Super( fab front clip) or do you just have a general admission ticket? I guess if you ever owned one you would know.
Is this kid really 15? Or is it we just think he is. If he has been a driver in this kind of car for 2 years. I’m sorry he was just to young for this class.
Oh and getting back to the tread. Jeff Jones.
Once again, you just don’t get it. Don’t forget, it was you bitching that your car can’t keep up with the bigger motor cars. Was that because of chassis (which is basically the same as all your competition) or because of motor (yours is lower HP than the others)?
If it’s all the same, why don’t you bring it on to the bigger tracks? The answer is that your CRATE will not keep up with a SUPER on the bigger tracks. Same chassis, different motor.
Just because your car has been allowed into the same shows as the Supers, doesn’t make yours one.
Look at it this way… you can bring a knife to a gunfight, but you can’t take a gun to a knife fight.
Have you ever been wrong? Or even mistaken?
Nope… didn’t think so.
How about Tallahassee’s Harvey Jones. I think he ran in 6 different decades, and raced into his '70’s. I seem to remember an upcoming Memorial race for Harvey, but can’t recall the details.
Not that it makes a difference but…
[QUOTE=Frasson118;91210]Once again, you just don’t get it. Don’t forget, it was you bitching that your car can’t keep up with the bigger motor cars. Was that because of chassis (which is basically the same as all your competition) or because of motor (yours is lower HP than the others)?
If it’s all the same, why don’t you bring it on to the bigger tracks? The answer is that your CRATE will not keep up with a SUPER on the bigger tracks. Same chassis, different motor.
Just because your car has been allowed into the same shows as the Supers, doesn’t make yours one.
Look at it this way… you can bring a knife to a gunfight, but you can’t take a gun to a knife fight.[/QUOTE]
…I concur. 2 against 1, we win!!