Citrus County Speedway cancels remainder of season….

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41

[QUOTE=katlizy;151167]I am going to admit this right off the bat… I didn’t read every post in this thread. I just want to tell you all (yes I said YOU ALL), that we do not visit race tracks every week anymore. Some of you dislike me because of my views on the TBARA… So I am sure you dont care… But allow me to tell you this…

As a fan, looking in from the outside, all you ppl do is whine and bitch because you aren’t getting your way. Admittedly, I was/am guilty of the same. The difference between you and me tho, is I have nothing to lose and you stand to lose more.

Regardless of what Gary said or did, your bitching and trashing led to him closing the track.

So let’s count… How many tracks are not running this year, or under performing due to personality conflicts and lack of attendance??? Two. That’s two too many. Suck it up, strap in and drive.

Stop acting like a bunch of middle school girls who’s feelings are hurt. Follow the rules, and do the right thing. SUPPORT your local track, so ppl like me will support you.

I’ve met some nice pplnat the track, and here… But I just spent my racing budget on a old Monte that I am going to restore and drive.

Let me know when the races are real… Maybe I will visit.[/QUOTE]

It seems that people put a lot more faith in message boards than they probably deserve. The idea of complaining on a message board shutting down a race track is pretty far fetched. I don’t imagine that negative reviews help a track at all, but i doubt they caused Gary to shut the doors.
But you bring up an interesting point. Are message board complaints by fans something that should be stopped or at least censored? Should the fans keep complaints to themselves so Gary or any other promoter won’t close their track down?
And should racers not be allowed to post their complaints? Just shut up and race? The situation at Citrus IS NOT caused by disgruntled racers. It isn’t even caused by gruntled racers. It’s caused by the the track promoter/Gary not doing a very good job. Need proof. Look back over the history of Citrus. Big car counts, big fan counts, far fewer complaints by fans and racers. Not zero complaints, but far fewer. What changed? The track was leased by Gary.
I don’t think the complaints and bitching about Citrus are what caused the track to close. No body takes Nathan seriously. But successful tracks have lot’s of complaints, they just know how to deal with them the right way.

42

[QUOTE=katlizy;151172]Nope… no race car… for my enjoyment only…

Now… if say I did meet your hypothetical above… if I chose mms ot to go to a track…i sure cant bitch about the consequences of my decision. Its my decision and I must own my role in the outcome.

Have a good day guys!![/QUOTE]

Come to Desoto, best show around.

43

[QUOTE=Matt Albee;151173]It seems that people put a lot more faith in message boards than they probably deserve. The idea of complaining on a message board shutting down a race track is pretty far fetched. I don’t imagine that negative reviews help a track at all, but i doubt they caused Gary to shut the doors.
But you bring up an interesting point. Are message board complaints by fans something that should be stopped or at least censored? Should the fans keep complaints to themselves so Gary or any other promoter won’t close their track down?
And should racers not be allowed to post their complaints? Just shut up and race? The situation at Citrus IS NOT caused by disgruntled racers. It isn’t even caused by gruntled racers. It’s caused by the the track promoter/Gary not doing a very good job. Need proof. Look back over the history of Citrus. Big car counts, big fan counts, far fewer complaints by fans and racers. Not zero complaints, but far fewer. What changed? The track was leased by Gary.
I don’t think the complaints and bitching about Citrus are what caused the track to close. No body takes Nathan seriously. But successful tracks have lot’s of complaints, they just know how to deal with them the right way.[/QUOTE]

http://www.news-sentinel.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20140702/SPORTS/140709893 (It can and has happened recently)

Before social media, if someone was angry, they would pick up the phone, make a phone call person to person and hash it out and resolve the problem if it could be resolved. Today, people would rather hide behind a fake forum name, or post on social media to avoid person to person conflict. In my eyes it’s a cowardly way to go about things.

I will and have contacted tracks directly due to issues I have faced over the years. If you be a man, you get treated like a man. If you disagree, then agree to disagree and move on. There is never any positive result from tearing down an individual person or a facility in public media where they may not even see it and have a chance to defend themselves. Whether you want to believe it or not, it does hurt both sides of the argument.

I agree 100% that complaints have to be dealt with the correct way in order to be productive, and yeah, I get the whole it’s a free country and people can say what they want, when they want, where they want. That’s all fine and dandy, but you have to think about the negative repercussions it can have on everybody as a whole, not just you or the track individually. The complaints need to be given in the proper way too. I am fine with people voicing displeasure. It’s human nature to kind of let loose when you are angry about something, but we really have to be careful as a community right now. Short Track racing across the country is on shaky ground. It’s very sad with tracks such as Gresham and Citrus closing and others laying dormant. This is why I keep saying, we have to do our best to put forth effort to be part of the solution and not the problem.

I don’t have all the answers, and nor does any one person on this board or on Facebook or anything, but I do know the future of this sport is in our hands whether you want to see that or not. It’s sadly a real slippery slope when it comes to all this. It can really go either way just gotta know that anything you or me or anyone says can be taken out of context really easily in this world today and have very negative impacts.

44

Perhaps another way to put it:

Be openly supportive of any tracks that you “like”.

BTW, Yoho is again offering an extra $10k to the pole sitter of the upcoming Eddie Braun Modified race if he starts in the back. That is a good thing.

Be constructive if there is something that you did not like –and provide a solution.

The 'net has also been a help. I can check tracks sites to see who is racing what, or to print directions, and so forth.

There are bigger problems than social media today. Tracks always came and went. Now we have regulations out the wazoo, and a public interested in other things–social media among them (say what?).

Like go carts and slot car racing, it is becoming a niche sport/hobby, and I am just glad that I got to be part of the heyday, and still am able to watch some great racing today.

45

Thanks for that link Phil. Interesting reading. My point in the earlier post was that complaints on message boards are not going to lead to a track closing down, unless those complaints are largely legitimate. And the Baer Field story is a case in point. The promoter fails to consider, even for a moment, that it was his decisions, his rules, his way of doing business, that were responsible for the decline in racers and fans. In his view, it had to be the trashing of his track on social media that was responsible. Oh, and the fact that he was forced to implement a new rule mandated by the insurance company. Now maybe the trash talk on the internet swayed some people. But 500 people??? No, i don’t think so. I think that track was just like Citrus and countless other tracks across the country. The track owner/promoter just isn’t very good at his job.
As far as social media being the bad boy, i’ve gotten involved in thousands of bashing sessions in the grandstands over the years. It doesn’t take the internet to get a discussion going, 20 people get together in the stands at every track in the country and discuss problems or bitch about unfair officiating. And the following week, the discussion gets even bigger. Ever hear any booing at tracks during driver introductions or after a driver is/or isn’t sent to the back after an incident? That didn’t require any input from social media at all.
I also see a lot of complaints regarding people using fake names on message boards. I really don’t know what difference that could make. Nathan posts things that i don’t agree with. And if he used the name Joe Smith, i still wouldn’t agree. Rick B. post things that irritate people all the time. If the very same posts were made by DramaQueen48, they wouldn’t be any better or worse.

46

[QUOTE=OldSchool+;151177]Perhaps another way to put it:

Be openly supportive of any tracks that you “like”.

BTW, Yoho is again offering an extra $10k to the pole sitter of the upcoming Eddie Braun Modified race if he starts in the back. That is a good thing.

Be constructive if there is something that you did not like –and provide a solution.

The 'net has also been a help. I can check tracks sites to see who is racing what, or to print directions, and so forth.

There are bigger problems than social media today. Tracks always came and went. Now we have regulations out the wazoo, and a public interested in other things–social media among them (say what?).

Like go carts and slot car racing, it is becoming a niche sport/hobby, and I am just glad that I got to be part of the heyday, and still am able to watch some great racing today.[/QUOTE]

I envy you greatly regarding being part of the sports “heyday”. I am extremely passionate about this sport and feel sometimes like I missed out on it’s best days which is disappointing. I hear so many great old stories from friends here and there talking about how racing “use to be” and huge fields of cars and standing room only crowds and I go to all my local tracks every week here and anywhere I can, and I look at the fields of cars and crowds in the stands and wonder “what can be done to help this”… It’s part of the reason I came to this board… To pass off my ideas and if they help it’s wonderful.

“Be openly supportive of any tracks that you “like”.” - I attend 3-4 tracks a week during race season. If I could get to more, I would. There are tracks I don’t like and have been treated poorly at yet I still support them and hope for better days. Because the FL tracks all (for some reason) run Saturdays exclusively, the fan base gets pretty spread out across the state each Saturday. I wish that tracks down there would adapt a scheduling idea similar to what we run up here as far as running some tracks Thursday Friday Saturday Sunday etc. I think it would be much healthier for everyone… There is always the possibility that it wouldn’t help or work at all, but it never hurts to start experimenting and see what happens.

47

[QUOTE=Matt Albee;151178]Thanks for that link Phil. Interesting reading. My point in the earlier post was that complaints on message boards are not going to lead to a track closing down, unless those complaints are largely legitimate. And the Baer Field story is a case in point. The promoter fails to consider, even for a moment, that it was his decisions, his rules, his way of doing business, that were responsible for the decline in racers and fans. In his view, it had to be the trashing of his track on social media that was responsible. Oh, and the fact that he was forced to implement a new rule mandated by the insurance company. Now maybe the trash talk on the internet swayed some people. But 500 people??? No, i don’t think so. I think that track was just like Citrus and countless other tracks across the country. The track owner/promoter just isn’t very good at his job.
As far as social media being the bad boy, i’ve gotten involved in thousands of bashing sessions in the grandstands over the years. It doesn’t take the internet to get a discussion going, 20 people get together in the stands at every track in the country and discuss problems or bitch about unfair officiating. And the following week, the discussion gets even bigger. Ever hear any booing at tracks during driver introductions or after a driver is/or isn’t sent to the back after an incident? That didn’t require any input from social media at all.
I also see a lot of complaints regarding people using fake names on message boards. I really don’t know what difference that could make. Nathan posts things that i don’t agree with. And if he used the name Joe Smith, i still wouldn’t agree. Rick B. post things that irritate people all the time. If the very same posts were made by DramaQueen48, they wouldn’t be any better or worse.[/QUOTE]

No problem, I assumed maybe you hadn’t heard that news. I’ve been there before when visiting family. Pretty cool track, sad that it closed for the year.

I agree everything is definitely subjective. If they are just petty complaints, people likely do just kind of brush them off and ignore it or at least take it with a grain of salt. There are definitely two sides to every problem but there are also two sides to every solution as well. Gotta keep you mindset like that or nothing will every be resolved imo.

I have personally been told by a couple people that when I move back, that I would be smart to stay away from Citrus, Showtime and Auburndale based on their opinion of the racing, drivers there and how the shows are run. But I personally will make that decision on my own based on my own personal experience. None of them will likely be my regular tracks unless I end up in the Ocala area where my friends are trying to sway me to move, but I am always up for learning and experiencing new tracks and forming my own opinion of them. I guess I am different from some in that regard but oh well, I am different from many I know in general so it doesn’t matter to me lol!

As for the forum names, my comment was a generalization. Thankfully, it hasn’t been encountered here by me much personally. I think regardless of people disagreeing with people that the Karnac community is a generally respectful group of guys and that’s why after a number of years of lurking around, I decided to start posting and talking to everyone. When I say people hide behind names it’s more aimed at people who come on for the sole reason of trashing a driver or track specifically with a false name and nobody knows who they are but they do it to cause trouble and get people talking. I’ve seen it many times over the years from YellowBullet to forums I have run or been a part of the admin crew. Those people I refer to as Keyboard Heroes… There is only 1 single person on this entire board that I personally take issue with.

48

One other thing i’d like to say, i don’t know that Gary is a bad guy and i don’t want anyone to think i’m saying that. I don’t know him. It’s sad that Citrus had to get to this stage. It just looks as though he was maybe not suited for being the head man at a race track. Or maybe he underestimated the money it would take. And he’s not alone there. Maybe he needs to hire a competent track manager to run things and just stay back out of the spotlight.

49

The track is closed so stop wasting time and start praying it gets turned around or the track gets a new promoter! The past is the past!

50

Lets just hope that history can repeat itself. This track has had a long history of being popular with racer and fan alike. I know the StPete. track has not helped but that is not the current issue. With proper leadership this track with its central location should be able to make it back.

51

I love desoto!!! But it is three hours away. I live in brevard

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[QUOTE=Matt Albee;151173]It seems that people put a lot more faith in message boards than they probably deserve. The idea of complaining on a message board shutting down a race track is pretty far fetched. I don’t imagine that negative reviews help a track at all, but i doubt they caused Gary to shut the doors.
But you bring up an interesting point. Are message board complaints by fans something that should be stopped or at least censored? Should the fans keep complaints to themselves so Gary or any other promoter won’t close their track down?
And should racers not be allowed to post their complaints? Just shut up and race? The situation at Citrus IS NOT caused by disgruntled racers. It isn’t even caused by gruntled racers. It’s caused by the the track promoter/Gary not doing a very good job. Need proof. Look back over the history of Citrus. Big car counts, big fan counts, far fewer complaints by fans and racers. Not zero complaints, but far fewer. What changed? The track was leased by Gary.
I don’t think the complaints and bitching about Citrus are what caused the track to close. No body takes Nathan seriously. But successful tracks have lot’s of complaints, they just know how to deal with them the right way.[/QUOTE]

I can assure you that MANY people take me seriously and concur with my statements and opinions. I am a realist, I call things the way I see them and do not look at life through a pair of rose colored glasses. Some people lack the spine to say it the way it is.Generations of racers and fans had stopped going to the track due to the BS. If that wasn’t the case the place would still be open! Hell, we had side bets going as to what month he was going to go out of business! Here are a few FACTS that everybody should know:

  1. Gary STILL owes a local business money for items purchased at the beginning of the season. His first attempt to pay the debt was written with a rubber check. Several other businesses pulled out of the track for lack of payment.

  2. Hoosier…he owes them money. Why do you think he has an outside tire supplier coming to sell tires at the track?

  3. Towel City…he owes them money too!

  4. Previous promoter…he owes him money and is behind in paying.

  5. Gary can’t even pay attention, much less the bills.

These are all factual statements. Social media didn’t ruin him, Gary ruined himself with the way he managed the track and his attitude. He may be able to move furniture, but he can not manage a race track.This same scenario happened at Punta Gorda. Why do you think that the airport didn’t award him the bid when he was the HIGH BIDDER? They knew better! We ALL tried to help Gary, myself included when he first came to the track. We wanted it to work and honestly gave him the benefit of the doubt. Gary inherited some problems, but rather than fixing those problems and moving forward, he created far more than he started with. Everything spiraled out of control from there…racers and fans stopped coming, vendors and suppliers didn’t get paid…track closes. The track was by no means perfect prior to Gary, it had its problems but we always had decent car counts, fans in the stands and the atmosphere was totally different. My family is coming up on 30 years at the track and we have never seen it like this. The picture below is the general consensus among the local racers :slight_smile:

Reed Miss me yet.jpg

53

I will assume everything stated is factual.

I too am not inherently a “rose colored glasses” kind of guy.

But, as I have moved on down the path, I have found there is more than one way to look at “realism”, and if I stare at the glass long enough I can find something in it.

"And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors."

I don’t really think the message involves the $20 my kid owes me, but rather forgiveness in my heart for others–regardless of whether they “earn” it or not.

Just food fer thought…

54

critter

When Critter was at Citrus, you never saw any negative posts on Karnac, Mainly all positive posts. Now that he is at Desoto, there are very few people bashing Desoto anymore. All business’s will have problems, the key to running any business, when a problem occurs, address it right away and fix it. Keeping the racers and the fans happy is a full time job. It takes a very skilled management team to run a race track successfully.

Vince Patola

55

Orlando sucks and needs to be dirt!Sorry,just had to do that.
Citrus ran for years as I arrended with my grandparents.Bridges are broke in this case looks like.

56

I don’t think you can do a drift show on dirt :slight_smile:

57

bithlo wet plains drifter

Ironic, isn’t it?

The drifting set attempts to drive like they are on dirt when they are on asphalt. Of course, that is the slow way to go, hence they need “judging” to determine a “winner”.

If they would take pretty much the same cars to a dirt track they could truly race as mini stocks.

Just another thing in life I don’t understand…

58

Every generation likes to think it has the greatest new ideas ever but usually it’s just reinventing the wheel, in our case it’s rather literal. It’s called the powerslide no matter what they wanna call it, it’s been around forever and I think if it keeps tracks in business that’s cool. I don’t get it either though, and I think it’s a passing fancy. I think as soon as they ever get a taste of real competition it’ll go away. Some promoter should figure out a way to entice them to all get out there all at one time and race for the win for 30 laps and “drifting” will become road racing around the infield of oval tracks.

59

[QUOTE=turnleft;151203]When Critter was at Citrus, you never saw any negative posts on Karnac, Mainly all positive posts. Now that he is at Desoto, there are very few people bashing Desoto anymore. All business’s will have problems, the key to running any business, when a problem occurs, address it right away and fix it. Keeping the racers and the fans happy is a full time job. It takes a very skilled management team to run a race track successfully.

Vince Patola[/QUOTE]

Your comment is a good one, based on fact.There were problems at Citrus, but Critter did all that he could do to correct them on the spot. The management aloud the dirty laundry to be aired on the race track’s discussion board that was mostly viewed by the locals who already knew what was going and had already formed an opinion.The majority of the problems were solved and we moved on. IF you had a problem and posted something or made a call to Critter it was usually handled. You didn’t always like the answer or outcome but it was a thing of the past in a short period of time. Did people make comments about Critter? Absolutely, almost all of us did at one time or another but you didn’t have DQ’s the week AFTER the race, multiple rule changes throughout the season, a tire that nobody wanted, rainouts called with any chance of rain in the forecast and Critter wasn’t a compulsive liar. Mr. Reed is also successful businessman…something Gary Laplant will never be. Gary took the board down so all of the negative stuff that was going on started going up on Karnac for EVERYBODY to see…we warned him that would happen, but he didn’t listen. ( I could make that statement 100+ times on multiple issues that have caused his demise up here). Things were not nearly as bad as they are now and I am sure that anyone with half a brain would take back Critter and Reed over Gary any day of the week.

60

Critter already has an excellent job.