Great call NSS!
I was disappointed in Choquette dumping Augie Grill. Augie may have rubbed him a bit, but that’s racing. Choquette intentionally dumped Grill and destroyed his racecar. Get him off the track, case closed, come here to race clean or don’t come back.
The stands are that full for all the big races @NSS so I’m sure the track won’t be losing “ticket revenue” from lost Choquette fans. What’s he going to do, dump anybody who passes him until noone is left and he wins by default??
In the drivers meeting it was clear the track would not put up with wrecking cars , just look at the clean racing for the finish. The track sent a message about parking cars and the drivers got the message!!!
Good call on the part of the track officials.
memo
Open message to drivers.
I got it. I know where you are coming from. Everyone feels like they are either justified to begin with (he was mirror driving) or they are retalliating. And some are justified. Nonetheless…
What is “right” aside (since the “officials” decide that, and…) here is the deal:
Move them and you will probably be okay.
They spin out and it is a big question mark.
They crash and you will in all probability be in the back or on the trailer.
I realize that “moving them” and “taking them out” may be the identical move on your part, and maybe you only meant to move them, but it is the results that will carry the weight.
Now you got the memo.
Ricky Brooks is the one that will not tolerate any of that non sense.
Who was the race director?
Not sure if that was Ricky, but from pit road - he wouldnt have been able to see squat. That call had to come from someone in the tower - and based on the reaction of the dude in the NASCAR shirt on top of the tower when he was approached by Gary Adrian and his son - I am guessing it was his decision. You dont get that pissy when someone else makes the call.
[QUOTE=JC26;152940]Leaning on someone to prevent them from having a straight away lead on a restart, and driving down into the turn and punting them are two extremely different things.
That’s like me punching you in the face because you shook my hand too hard.[/QUOTE]
Actually, they aren’t two extremely different things at all. Intentionally running into another car, no matter what your reason, or how hard, or at what point on the track, doesn’t make the slightest difference if track officials can DQ you for it. A driver receiving a slight bump from the car behind might easily save it and go on. Or a less talented driver might get the same bump and lose it into the wall. Same bump at the same place.
I see it as NSS overreacting and Jeff getting shot for shaking Augie’s hand too hard.
[QUOTE=Matt Albee;152952]Actually, they aren’t two extremely different things at all. Intentionally running into another car, no matter what your reason, or how hard, or at what point on the track, doesn’t make the slightest difference if track officials can DQ you for it. A driver receiving a slight bump from the car behind might easily save it and go on. Or a less talented driver might get the same bump and lose it into the wall. Same bump at the same place.
I see it as NSS overreacting and Jeff getting shot for shaking Augie’s hand too hard.[/QUOTE]
You have your mind made up as a fan that what happened is wrong on the part of NSS. And that’s fine. But from a racers point, I think your mindset is a little skewed.
80% of the cars there yesterday had tire marks on them because rubbing and leaning on someone is part of the sport. There’s not one race car driver on this board who can say they’ve never rubbed someone to get them lose or put their car right up against theirs to keep them in a line or slid up into someone in a corner. If you want to watch follow the leader then go watch trains ride around. If you want to see hard nose racing, then expect fenders to touch, tires to rub and aggressiveness to be in full force. But driving through someone and intentionally wrecking them is not by any means racing. What Augie did was precise and there wasn’t and malicious intent. Anyone at NSS yesterday that had eyes and was looking in turn one could tell there was malicious intent from the 29.
[QUOTE=JC26;152956]You have your mind made up as a fan that what happened is wrong on the part of NSS. And that’s fine. But from a racers point, I think your mindset is a little skewed.
80% of the cars there yesterday had tire marks on them because rubbing and leaning on someone is part of the sport. There’s not one race car driver on this board who can say they’ve never rubbed someone to get them lose or put their car right up against theirs to keep them in a line or slid up into someone in a corner. If you want to watch follow the leader then go watch trains ride around. If you want to see hard nose racing, then expect fenders to touch, tires to rub and aggressiveness to be in full force. But driving through someone and intentionally wrecking them is not by any means racing. What Augie did was precise and there wasn’t and malicious intent. Anyone at NSS yesterday that had eyes and was looking in turn one could tell there was malicious intent from the 29.[/QUOTE]
And there it is, the " You fans can’t possibly know what really went on " defense. And this brings us right back to my original post where i said that the DQ was excessive. A 1 lap penalty ( which almost always happens in these cases ) or up to a five lap penalty would be reasonable for what went on. And we’ll just assume that the folks who described Augie leaning on Jeff were just those mis-informed fans again.
I’d agree that cars get together on the track all the time. And i’d also say that there isn’t a driver out there who hasn’t intentionally tried to spin someone out, or run them up to the wall in the corners.
But my point is, the penalty was far too harsh and while your defense of Augie and his precision driving is admirable, Jeff’s fans could just as easily say he was tired of Augie trying to wreck him. It’s a judgement call, and in this case whoever made the call over reacted. Or was a friend of Augie.
By the way, there’s no debate that it was intentional, Jeff admitted to that in an interview. I just think the penalty was way over the top.
For anyone that is questioning whether the intent was to ‘bump’ Grill to send a message or something more malicious… It was made quite clear… Here is the quote from Choquette to Speed51 immediately following the incident…
(as reported on Trackside Now)
“I had a lot of respect for Augie and I thought he had a lot of respect for me but he used my whole left side up,” said Choquette. “I went down into turn one and I turned him. That’s the honest to God truth. I won’t say I didn’t. You race me like that and that’s what you’re going to get. You’ll be standing over there with a wrecked race car.”
.
.
“…You race me like that and that’s what you’re going to get. You’ll be standing over there with a wrecked race car.”–Jeff Choquette
As a fan, I like guys with that mindset. They make it interesting to watch, and if I agree with them, vicariously enjoy the action.
That said, Balough (and, as I have said, I like{d} to watch Gary run) seemed to wind up in the wall a lot himself.
Fair enough.
On the other hand, I notice that owners of cars that tend to have the same driver also tend not to go through a lot of front clips.
That is why the Anderson’s have it going on. It is their car, and they know the consequences, wallet wise. I wouldn’t recommend “leaning” on them too long either…
[QUOTE=Matt Albee;152952]Actually, they aren’t two extremely different things at all. Intentionally running into another car, no matter what your reason, or how hard, or at what point on the track, doesn’t make the slightest difference if track officials can DQ you for it. A driver receiving a slight bump from the car behind might easily save it and go on. Or a less talented driver might get the same bump and lose it into the wall. Same bump at the same place.
I see it as NSS overreacting and Jeff getting shot for shaking Augie’s hand too hard.[/QUOTE]
Your point that two different drivers receiving the exact same hit could end up with drastically different results is valid. However it has nothing to do with what occurred yesterday. Augie leaned on Jeff (doorhandle to doorhandle), Jeff drove through Augie (nose to tail with an added element of coming up the track while doing it) - not even close to the same chances of wreck the victim in those two scenarios. Could Jeff have wrecked from what Augie did - sure, but it wasnt likely. Was Augie going to wreck after what Jeff did? Absolutely.
All that said, I dont like what NSS did. Some other penalty would have met the standard that seems to have been set since i have been watching short track racing.
[QUOTE=Matt Albee;152959]And there it is, the " You fans can’t possibly know what really went on " defense. And this brings us right back to my original post where i said that the DQ was excessive. A 1 lap penalty ( which almost always happens in these cases ) or up to a five lap penalty would be reasonable for what went on. And we’ll just assume that the folks who described Augie leaning on Jeff were just those mis-informed fans again.
I’d agree that cars get together on the track all the time. And i’d also say that there isn’t a driver out there who hasn’t intentionally tried to spin someone out, or run them up to the wall in the corners.
But my point is, the penalty was far too harsh and while your defense of Augie and his precision driving is admirable, Jeff’s fans could just as easily say he was tired of Augie trying to wreck him. It’s a judgement call, and in this case whoever made the call over reacted. Or was a friend of Augie.
By the way, there’s no debate that it was intentional, Jeff admitted to that in an interview. I just think the penalty was way over the top.[/QUOTE]Shoulda, woulda, and coulda are all easy when we’re sitting in the bleachers. That was my point. I’m not an Augie fan, but the guy was fast and always puts on a show. For him to drive the 10 hours to get there and then be wrecked that early over something stupid and go home with a destroyed car, it’s only fair that Choqutte went with him. My whole standpoint is that Augies crime didn’t fit the punishment. But, I do believe Choquettes punishment fit the crime.
>One can see the action far better from the stands than the pits, usually.
>I cannot count the number of times a driver has watched a replay and then seen an incident in a different light. Most recently that I can remember–Kyle Larson after the dirt truck race at Tony’s track.
>Not always, but over the course of my lifetime, when the officials make a call I generally disagree with it.
>Typically, the way folks “see” an incident has to do with who they were affiliated with or rooting for before the incident.
>To discount someone’s opinion solely because they are in the stands is…in my opinion…not valid.
ps–JC & Bubba–Y’all agree on the crime, but not the punishment.
Each is entitled to their opinion (in my opinion {lol}).
He admitted to intentionally wrecking the guy, how could you not park him? Moving a guy, roughing him up and all happens but you wreck him for it getting yourself parked that early? Kind of rookie in my opinion. You put that rough housing in your pocket and then when the spot really counts it’s an easy get, it might not even be there that day but in time it’ll come and then you remember. He lost his cool and ruined his day, all of his crew/owners, and his fans, as well as Augie’s…I don’t blame the track.
Here’s something that I don’t get. I looked at the race results today and Choquette was scored with a 25th place finish. Wouldn’t dq mean a last place finish?
bad calls
One big story that is being overlooked from the race, is sending the Nassee team to the rear for having a pit member by there car after quilifying. I also believe 6 or 7 other teams had this problem. My first big concern is how was Ricky Brookes determining who were crew member and who were not?? Access to the cars on pit road was open for any person in the pits to walk up to any of the cars?? In my eyes this was a poor judgment call on the officials. This is not Nascar!!! 7th place —38th place paid 650 dollars, this is not a grat payout. The Nassee team must have spent at least 5 grand to go to this race, and this penelty was wrong. Ricky Brooks is a good tech man, but making a statment in the drivers meeting about crews not going near the cars, after they quilify, and how it was inforced, was piss poor in my judjment. Vince P.
Could’nt agree more…I watch Travis Cope get out of his car after he qualified…he was by himself…walked over to the wall to talk with his dad (Mike) …No crew went to the car…I tried to talk with an Official, but the guy that was giving that picture away kept saying “They have it on tape”…
I for one would love to see “That Tape” …I’ll admit my wrong “If” Ricky will admit his wrong with the tape results…I know that no crew went to the car…Cope got screwed before the race even started…But he showed em’ from the rear of the field…hope he gets a public appology…OSF
What did they spend 5 grand on?
A friend of mine that was there said he heard NSS was filming pit road just to enforce the no touch rule. That’s a pretty long pit road. I wonder if they were filming wide angle to watch all of the cars, or just each car as it came onto pit road.
I guess i’m just curious about the rule itself. Are NASCAR crews not allowed to touch cars after qualifying? If the driver steps out of the car on pit road after qualifying at NSS and the car needs to be moved forward in line for some reason, does the driver have to push it himself? And if a team member messed with something on pit road, isn’t that what tech after the race is for?
I’ll bet every single team affected has requested the tape.
But the ruling sure didn’t affect Travis Cope very much.